Former Mulroney Dep. Chief of Staff and PR flack Communications Director Luc Lavoie presented himself to the Commons Ethics committee on February 7. The following is NOT a transcript, so quote at your own risk ;) Time-stamps are approximate. This is the final installment of the Lavoie testimony. To return to the beginning of this series, click here: Part I.
A high-maintenance relationship
4:38 PM
Lavallée (BQ): when we look and see who benefitted, we see that the letter of request (LOR) to Swiss authorities, we see that the only people who benefitted from LOR were the people around BM, b/c indeed it allowed him to collect 2.1 mill. Do you know the name of the person who leaked that LOR?
Luc Lavoie: I don't know. The settlement in Jan 97 said that the inquiry would be continued. There was more than one leak. 5 leaks.
Lavallée (BQ): but the first leak, to Financial Post..
Luc Lavoie: (interrupting) excuse me, that was not the first leak. The first was written by Agence France Presse (AFP), then Der Spiegel, then Maclean's. At that time, we were monitoring to see which leak would be the first to be published. Friday, Nov 17 5pm, a journalist I didn't know called BM's office, it was referred to me, and he spoke about leak, and we gave a short stmt prepared by lawyers.
Lavallée (BQ): any idea who was the leaker?
Luc Lavoie: we could go on speculating, but very honestly, I have no idea what source of leak was. Some leaks, I can imagine, let's say Stevie Cameron played a major role as both a journalist and a police informant. She had a code attached to her name and all of a sudden, one of the calls was from her...she was probably the one at the root of the letter.
Lavallée (BQ): yeah, but she didn't write it.
Luc Lavoie: well, the officer she worked with was Fiegenwald and he was the one who wrote the letter
Lavallée (BQ): does he write in German?
Luc Lavoie: no, it was translated in German. Originally in English.
Lavallée (BQ): there's something odd--there are a number of things that BM didn't tell you, but you were his spokesperson. His press officer, his adviser! You're the person to whom he should have entrusted a great deal of info. I'm sure you're extremely talented (*flirt*), and I've worked with clients in an agency, and normally we get the client to tell us his entire strategy...at the level you were, you should have asked questions. The reason you didn't ask questions--was it b/c you felt on shaky legal ground? Or b/c BM knew everything wasn't above board?
Luc Lavoie: there were two periods. 95-97, a time where it was my job to be BM's PR consultant. I could devote all my time and resources necessary to serve him. As of 2000, when I joined Quebecor, I helped him and his family when they had Communications issues (especially when he was ill), but very honestly, it was not my job, I didn't see him on a daily, weekly or monthly basis. Spoke on phone, maybe 3 min, 5 min.
4:44 PM
Mulcair (NDP): going back to spring 2000, M. Tremblay, BM's lawyer, when he told you it was a retainer. You've used that word in all public stmts thereafter. There's a meaning to that word for a lawyer, but also has a meaning in terms of taxes--e.g. paid in trust, not yet considered revenue. When you learned in 2000 that he'd received money from KHS, in thousands of dollars...BM said he'd never had any dealings with him except for coffee in a hotel. At the time, did you ask if BM had reported money to Revenue Canada?
Luc Lavoie: didn't have to ask, b/c he told me he'd paid his taxes. I was told of three instalments and the taxes paid thereof. That's what I learned.
Mulcair (NDP): did you then speak to BM about that amount, at any time spring 2000-2008?
Luc Lavoie: one evening on telephone, last fall, before he testitfied.
Mulcair (NDP): you're his main spokesperson. You brought up sum of 300K. You don't have a good reason for these major contradictions? I didn't expect you to say under oath that between spring 2000 and fall 2007, with client former PM, that you NEVER spoke about money?
Luc Lavoie: but he wasn't a client last year...
Mulcair (NDP): but he used to be...
Luc Lavoie: ok, ok, but I never discussed that sum with him
Mulcair (NDP): you heard the quotes attributed to you last fall...BM never told you to correct amount you were quoted in media? 3 X 75K rather than 3 x 100K?
Luc Lavoie: he told me one night on the phone that it was 3 x 75K
4:48 PM
Hubbard (LPC): On Tues we heard from Mr. Spector that you worked in PMO around the same time. Am I right to assume that you were there as part of PC Party?
Luc Lavoie: I was never a member of any party, at any time
Hubbard (LPC): and when Mr. Spector talked of money flowing through the office, you're not aware of any of that PC Canada fund or didn't see any of that activity?
Luc Lavoie: what activity?
Hubbard (LPC): he talked about 5K/month, coming from somewhere...you don't (remember)?
Luc Lavoie: no
Hubbard (LPC): we hear that the present government has cutoff any relationship btwn BM and any of Harper gov. Curious to me why you've ceased to work with him, as of fall 2007. What reason? Tied in w/Harper government muzzling? Do you have any relationship w/Harper government, in terms of any members of the board or...
Luc Lavoie: number one, my relationship w/BM was terminated because...helping BM w/communication when it involved 6-7 calls/month was something I could deal with; helping BM when it involved 30, 35 calls/month in the level of crisis...simply incompatible with my profession (Ha! Turns out Mulroney was 'high maintenance' *snerk*). Number two...nothing to do w/cutoff by Harper government. Number three, I haven't had any contact w/Harper's ministers, but it might happen in future because our business is regulated.
Hubbard (LPC): when you have a friend who's in big trouble...and you're the expert...why would one of my best friends leave when I'm in need of help? (*ouch*)
Luc Lavoie: I don't know I'm his best friend, but we still have a friendly relationship, but I could not serve him well b/c I have a real-time job as an executive of a major corporation, and I could not perform my duty.
Szabo (chair, LPC): M. Lavoie, c'est ca! (laughing)
Luc Lavoie: thanks M. Szabo
Szabo (chair, LPC): you've challenged us a little bit. Your name might come up again, when we review at the end. Suspend for 5 min.
Coming up next: Mulroney's former chef testifies (Part I: "The cook, the thief, his wife & her envelopes"). Or, return to Part V of the Lavoie testimony ("Szabo lets fly with an awesome (near) curse-word")
Phone kitty pic courtesy of Icanhascheezburger.com
Lavallée (BQ): when we look and see who benefitted, we see that the letter of request (LOR) to Swiss authorities, we see that the only people who benefitted from LOR were the people around BM, b/c indeed it allowed him to collect 2.1 mill. Do you know the name of the person who leaked that LOR?
Luc Lavoie: I don't know. The settlement in Jan 97 said that the inquiry would be continued. There was more than one leak. 5 leaks.
Lavallée (BQ): but the first leak, to Financial Post..
Luc Lavoie: (interrupting) excuse me, that was not the first leak. The first was written by Agence France Presse (AFP), then Der Spiegel, then Maclean's. At that time, we were monitoring to see which leak would be the first to be published. Friday, Nov 17 5pm, a journalist I didn't know called BM's office, it was referred to me, and he spoke about leak, and we gave a short stmt prepared by lawyers.
Lavallée (BQ): any idea who was the leaker?
Luc Lavoie: we could go on speculating, but very honestly, I have no idea what source of leak was. Some leaks, I can imagine, let's say Stevie Cameron played a major role as both a journalist and a police informant. She had a code attached to her name and all of a sudden, one of the calls was from her...she was probably the one at the root of the letter.
Lavallée (BQ): yeah, but she didn't write it.
Luc Lavoie: well, the officer she worked with was Fiegenwald and he was the one who wrote the letter
Lavallée (BQ): does he write in German?
Luc Lavoie: no, it was translated in German. Originally in English.
Lavallée (BQ): there's something odd--there are a number of things that BM didn't tell you, but you were his spokesperson. His press officer, his adviser! You're the person to whom he should have entrusted a great deal of info. I'm sure you're extremely talented (*flirt*), and I've worked with clients in an agency, and normally we get the client to tell us his entire strategy...at the level you were, you should have asked questions. The reason you didn't ask questions--was it b/c you felt on shaky legal ground? Or b/c BM knew everything wasn't above board?
Luc Lavoie: there were two periods. 95-97, a time where it was my job to be BM's PR consultant. I could devote all my time and resources necessary to serve him. As of 2000, when I joined Quebecor, I helped him and his family when they had Communications issues (especially when he was ill), but very honestly, it was not my job, I didn't see him on a daily, weekly or monthly basis. Spoke on phone, maybe 3 min, 5 min.
4:44 PM
Mulcair (NDP): going back to spring 2000, M. Tremblay, BM's lawyer, when he told you it was a retainer. You've used that word in all public stmts thereafter. There's a meaning to that word for a lawyer, but also has a meaning in terms of taxes--e.g. paid in trust, not yet considered revenue. When you learned in 2000 that he'd received money from KHS, in thousands of dollars...BM said he'd never had any dealings with him except for coffee in a hotel. At the time, did you ask if BM had reported money to Revenue Canada?
Luc Lavoie: didn't have to ask, b/c he told me he'd paid his taxes. I was told of three instalments and the taxes paid thereof. That's what I learned.
Mulcair (NDP): did you then speak to BM about that amount, at any time spring 2000-2008?
Luc Lavoie: one evening on telephone, last fall, before he testitfied.
Mulcair (NDP): you're his main spokesperson. You brought up sum of 300K. You don't have a good reason for these major contradictions? I didn't expect you to say under oath that between spring 2000 and fall 2007, with client former PM, that you NEVER spoke about money?
Luc Lavoie: but he wasn't a client last year...
Mulcair (NDP): but he used to be...
Luc Lavoie: ok, ok, but I never discussed that sum with him
Mulcair (NDP): you heard the quotes attributed to you last fall...BM never told you to correct amount you were quoted in media? 3 X 75K rather than 3 x 100K?
Luc Lavoie: he told me one night on the phone that it was 3 x 75K
4:48 PM
Hubbard (LPC): On Tues we heard from Mr. Spector that you worked in PMO around the same time. Am I right to assume that you were there as part of PC Party?
Luc Lavoie: I was never a member of any party, at any time
Hubbard (LPC): and when Mr. Spector talked of money flowing through the office, you're not aware of any of that PC Canada fund or didn't see any of that activity?
Luc Lavoie: what activity?
Hubbard (LPC): he talked about 5K/month, coming from somewhere...you don't (remember)?
Luc Lavoie: no
Hubbard (LPC): we hear that the present government has cutoff any relationship btwn BM and any of Harper gov. Curious to me why you've ceased to work with him, as of fall 2007. What reason? Tied in w/Harper government muzzling? Do you have any relationship w/Harper government, in terms of any members of the board or...
Luc Lavoie: number one, my relationship w/BM was terminated because...helping BM w/communication when it involved 6-7 calls/month was something I could deal with; helping BM when it involved 30, 35 calls/month in the level of crisis...simply incompatible with my profession (Ha! Turns out Mulroney was 'high maintenance' *snerk*). Number two...nothing to do w/cutoff by Harper government. Number three, I haven't had any contact w/Harper's ministers, but it might happen in future because our business is regulated.
Hubbard (LPC): when you have a friend who's in big trouble...and you're the expert...why would one of my best friends leave when I'm in need of help? (*ouch*)
Luc Lavoie: I don't know I'm his best friend, but we still have a friendly relationship, but I could not serve him well b/c I have a real-time job as an executive of a major corporation, and I could not perform my duty.
Szabo (chair, LPC): M. Lavoie, c'est ca! (laughing)
Luc Lavoie: thanks M. Szabo
Szabo (chair, LPC): you've challenged us a little bit. Your name might come up again, when we review at the end. Suspend for 5 min.
Coming up next: Mulroney's former chef testifies (Part I: "The cook, the thief, his wife & her envelopes"). Or, return to Part V of the Lavoie testimony ("Szabo lets fly with an awesome (near) curse-word")
Phone kitty pic courtesy of Icanhascheezburger.com
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